Re: [-empyre-] meat and potatoes space

["Christine Goldbeck" <cgoldie@verizon.net>]

Marc:

I see a lot more positive in this discussion than you do and I  think there 
has been more than a stating of opinions. At least, for me, this exchange 
has compelled me to reconsider my thoughts and re-examine events concerning 
the power of new media in activist endeavors.

The dialogue may not have changed my mind, but the fact that it compelled me 
to re-think is, I think, a positive outcome.

It is vital, I believe, that we not become so entrenched in our beliefs 
(about tech or any other issue) that we fail to listen, fail to debate, fail 
to re-think ...

All the best,
Christine

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "marc" <sparkle@c-level.cc>
To: "soft_skinned_space" <empyre@gamera.cofa.unsw.edu.au>
Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2005 1:35 AM
Subject: Re: [-empyre-] meat and potatoes space


> For me, this thread is a great snap-shot of our current moment and a 
> weakness of our collective  discursive practice.
>
> We all agree in the end! And that is all we learn!
> Where has this conversation gone?
>
> This is the atomization of our intellectual heritage and future so that we 
> have no agenda besides stating our opinion.
>
> Christina and I set out an agenda in week one, and I set out an outline 
> entitled "play ball" inviting collective engagement towards progressive 
> problem solving.
>
> Weeks later, we are bickering (me included) about things that seem like we 
> can all somewhat agree upon.
>
>
> Sad.
>
> Marc
>
>
>
>
> On Nov 29, 2005, at 9:23 PM, Ryan Griffis wrote:
>
> > On Nov 29, 2005, at 7:00 PM, marc wrote:
> > > I would imagine that we could collectively imagine that there is a
> > > hybrid practices between the web and the "meat-world" (great term). And
> > > that we could collectively allow for a functionality on both
> > > extremes...
> >
> > i think Robby's post is meant to be a bit (or more) provocative here (of 
> > course, i've been known to be wrong!). and his crit of tech lines up with 
> > some of the other concerns about the false promises of IT to deliver 
> > democracy, so it's not without some sound foundation. Read Hakim Bey (aka 
> > Peter Lamborn Wilson) lately?
> > Trebor text posted earlier i think also asks some great questions that 
> > had a couple people on his New Media Education challenging the 
> > effectiveness of  IT for the purposes of the left.
> > http://mailman.thing.net/pipermail/idc/2005-November/000089.html
> > Anyway, i think the whole dichotomy thing IT/anti-IT is kind of a 
> > distraction and a bit of a red herring... were people arguing over 
> > whether or not the printing press was going to change the world for the 
> > better, lift up the oppressed, just by being produced?
> > it did no doubt change the world, but it certainly didn't eliminate 
> > oppression, as our reality testifies to.
> > great posts.
> > ryan
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > empyre@lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au
> > http://www.subtle.net/empyre
>
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